Learning to Lead Anywhere feat. Chris Stillwell ’24

[00:00]Brian Jackson: Welcome to Owl Have You Know, a podcast from Rice Business. This episode is part of our Pivot Series, where guests share stories of transformation in their lives and careers.

Today, we're joined by Chris Stillwell, a Rice Business Full-Time MBA graduate from the class of 2024, who's taken a unique path from military intelligence to the world of finance. In the military, Chris built a foundation in leadership, discipline, and decision-making under pressure. He later transitioned to consulting, including time in Dubai, working on M&A Integration and Strategy. That experience led him to Rice Business, where he pursued an MBA to sharpen his financial skills and pivot into investment banking.

In this episode, we cover Chris's military experience, why he chose Rice, how the program supported a major career shift, and his advice for veterans and professionals considering a career transition through an MBA.

Hey, Chris, it's great to have you join me on Owl Have You Know.

[01:00]Chris Stillwell: Thanks for having me, Brian. I appreciate it. Appreciate being here.

[01:03]Brian Jackson: You've had one of the more fascinating career arcs that I think I've covered, from military intelligence to strategy consulting in Dubai and now investment banking at Bank of America. I mean, I heard military intelligence, and of course, I'm thinking of all the Hollywood movies. You know? It's really dramatic. Everything seems so cinematic, right? And has to happen quickly, and it's life-or-death decisions. But I guess from your experience, there's got to be a gap in these portrayals and, like, the real substance of military intelligence work.

[01:37]Chris Stillwell: 100%. I think that it sounds a lot sexier than it really is. Like, there's a lot of military movies out there. One of my jobs with the Army I commanded a drone unit. And I don't know if you've ever heard of the movie Eye in the Sky. I remember watching that, it was like, with Helen Mirren, it's all about drones.

I remember watching that and was like, "This is not how any of this works. This is, like, the complete antithesis of how we operate and how things are actually done." I just remember, like, getting out of that movie just being, like, frustrated. So, it's not as cool as some of the movies portray. Like, we can't identify people's faces from a drone 5,000 feet in the sky, but we could certainly do some other cool things, for sure.

[02:15]Brian Jackson: But you spent more than five years, right, in the Army, and you were in roles in Texas and New York. You know, could you tell me a bit about those roles?

[02:23]Chris Stillwell: So, I did four years active duty, and I did one year in the Reserves in, in New York for a bit. And when I was in active duty, I was stationed here in Texas at Fort Hood up in Killeen. Actually, lived in Austin, used to commute up there. As an intelligence officer, you know, I was primarily responsible for advising infantry or tank units on, you know, what the enemy course of action would be.

And I would have, like, a team of analysts that would assist me and, kind of, be like the red hat, we would call it, for the operations team, so that we can develop a plan to ultimately, like, defeat that enemy, whether it was in a training scenario or in a, you know, more forward-deployed scenario. I spent nine months in the Middle East as well, bouncing around a couple countries. But yeah, mostly you do intelligence advising attached to those units. Then I had one year where I was, you know, command that your own unit as well.

[03:10]Brian Jackson: So, I mean, all this is teamwork, and it seems to be situations where you're under pressure. Like, as a leader and as someone now who approaches teamwork, has this shaped, kind of, how you work across functions?

[03:21]Chris Stillwell: Absolutely. I think, you know, the military is a unique experience for a lot of people, especially those going to be an officer after school. Whether you go to West Point or ROTC, you're a 22-year-old kid, and then you're like, "Hey, here's a bunch of people you're now in charge of, you know, their lives and their responsibilities. Go after it." You know? And it's, there's no, like, manual, pretty much, of how to be a good leader. I mean, there's plenty of books written about it, but you really do have to learn.

And, you know, learn from not only your peers, but learn from people who are more senior than you as well. And, you know, as an intelligence officer, too, it's, kind of, a lot of pressures on you as well, is when you're trying to make the right call and give the right advice to your senior leaders, because bad advice or bad calls can really affect how you're operating.

[04:05]Brian Jackson: I know you probably can't talk much in specifics about it, but I'm sure you're, kind of, on pins and needles until the operation's over and you know that the intelligence was actionable and accurate.

[04:14]Chris Stillwell: Yeah. And you're also doing work during the operation as well. You're assessing, like, how much of the, let's say, enemy forces that have been you know, attrited. So, how much is remaining? You're also assessing what if there could be, like, a counterattack, let's say, or any kind of additional things that the enemy could do.

And then you're also organizing and helping any kind of collection efforts, making sure that you're looking in the right places to see where these additional enemy, like, attacks could come from, and then making sure that you're sending that information upwards and downwards. And I think that's maybe a good segue into, back to your original question, is, you know, how being a military officer helped me be, kind of, in my current role, and even at Rice, was, in the military, you are a leader, but you learn how to be a good follower as well. And I think what you do with that is that you are able to have great teamwork.

You're able, like, in my current job now, I have an analyst underneath me, but I have people like VPs and MDs above me, and I can understand what their intent is and what we need to get accomplished in our day-to-day job, but also articulate to the, you know, people below me, "Hey, this is the intent and this is how we do it." So, it's, kind of, been very helpful in those soft skills.

[05:19]Brian Jackson: Definitely. So, that would be one of the, I guess, mindsets that you took from the Army. Is there maybe a habit that you developed that you still lean on today?

[05:25]Chris Stillwell: From the military? I would say definitely getting things done is maybe the wrong way to say it, but, like, you know, or maybe getting a decision made. I mean, the worst thing you can do in the military is be indecisive. You got to make sure that you make decisions under pressure. And even today, like, I see it sometimes, you know, to my detriment or to my benefit.

You know, I want to make a decision now, whereas some people might want to sit on it and deliberate, and like, "No, let's just do this. Let's go for it, and let's adjust accordingly." So, that's definitely something I continue to do now.

[05:56]Brian Jackson: In corporate America, I see a lot of decisions get to the back burner, so you're exactly right. Like, how do you push it and say, "How do we get this decision point, make this actionable?"

[06:05]Chris Stillwell: Even just advancing meetings. Like, people, so many times will just sit around and just wait for someone to talk, and you're just sitting in this meeting for, like, extra minutes. Or, like, no, everyone's dancing around a question or dancing around an answer, and you're just like, "You got to progress the meeting," and you got to go, "Okay, let's go to this slide." "Okay, let's move here. Let's move there."

[06:22]Brian Jackson: So, Chris, could you tell me what inspired you to join the military?

[06:26]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, I mean, my story was, is not, like, super profound. Like, no one in my family served in the military. Actually, I just did I was an Eagle Scout, and Boy Scouts really exposed me to it, and I wanted to serve my country, so I did ROTC when I was in college. That was, kind of, my drive.

[06:41]Brian Jackson: Awesome. I'm an Eagle Scout too, but I didn't go as far as you. What was your Eagle Scout project?

[06:48]Chris Stillwell: So, I went to high school in New Jersey, and New Jersey's very, I guess, old. And so, there was an old cemetery there from the 1600s, but there were people buried in the 1700s and 1800s there as well. And one person was, like, from the Revolutionary War as well as a veteran. And so, they needed somebody to clean it up and document, like, who's even buried here? And so, that's what I did, was I cleaned up this cemetery, documented all the gravestones, took pictures, and, kind of, put a little memorial there so that people could visit and stuff like that.

[07:19]Brian Jackson: That's fantastic.

[07:20]Chris Stillwell: What was yours?

[07:21]Brian Jackson: Mine was in Malaysia, in Kuala Lumpur, and it was with the SPCA. And dogs get, kind of, a tough case there, so we repainted and cleaned kennels. And we had this mural in the front that had dogs and cats and everything painted on it, and it was really pretty. It took way longer than I anticipated and was much bigger of a project than I thought I signed up for, but, yeah, it was a lot of fun. Four weekends in a row, painting.

[07:52]Chris Stillwell: I can imagine it's rewarding, though. I think the Eagle Scout project, definitely something that not a lot of people get to do, and it definitely helps a lot of people in the community.

[08:01]Brian Jackson: It does. So, your pivot, one I think is from Army to consulting in Dubai. How did you end up there? Was that kind of the focus? Was it, "Okay, geographic choice, I wanted to go abroad?" Or was it consulting, and the geography was the bonus?

[08:17]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, great question. I have a very, I guess, weird path to consulting in Dubai, which I, you know, I was not expecting. One already, being in the Middle East when I was in the military, I thought I would never go back to the Middle East. And lo and behold, I ended up going to Dubai. Luckily, when I was in the military, I actually was in Dubai, so at least I had been to that city before, so I wasn't foreign to it.

And consulting, when I was in college, I interned pretty much every semester and every summer. And in the summers, I actually interned two years in consulting, so I was familiar with the space. And when I was leaving the military, I had an offer from Deloitte in DC, and then I also… Kearney actually reached out to me. I didn't apply to them. A recruiter reached out to me and said, "Hey, we're trying to build our Dubai office. We had some success hiring a couple of veterans. Would you be interested in coming to our office?"

And I was like, "Oh, actually, I heard…" I looked at the firm, I did some research, and, you know, they're a great kind of boutique consulting firm, kind of, similar, I would say, strategy to what the MBBs do in terms of, like, strategic consulting. And I was like, "You know what? It'd be really cool to live abroad, maybe for a year or two. And when I moved out there, I thought I was going to only be out there for a year or two." And I ended up being out there for three years. So, I did enjoy it.

[09:26]Brian Jackson: So, you spent time at the Mall of the Emirates?

[09:29]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, I lived nearby, so I could walk there if I wanted to.

[09:33]Brian Jackson: It's actually the first place I ever skied, was in Dubai, at the Mall of the Emirates.

[09:38]Chris Stillwell: Wow. A little icy, though, right?

[09:40]Brian Jackson: Yeah, not great. Not a good experience. But yeah, you know, still get to say I skied in the desert. So, it's something.

[09:47]Chris Stillwell: Absolutely.

[09:48]Brian Jackson: So, three years as an expat, you know. I grew up as an expat brat. I had my own experience with it. Be curious about some of your takeaways. What did you think about living abroad as an American?

[09:59]Chris Stillwell: Similar to, I would say, most Americans, I feel like… Or say a lot of Americans, we love to travel. And I've traveled a lot around the world even before I lived abroad. But living abroad, I think, is a completely different kind of experience than just traveling and being somewhere for a week. Like, you miss small things, like pretzels. I don't know why, but pretzels were incredibly hard to get in Dubai. And I don't really like pretzels that much, but just the lack of it made it more attractive.

And then there were just, like, small nuances of, like, "Oh, wow, this is actually something that's significantly different in terms of how something operates in a foreign country compared to, like, your home." But Dubai was an interesting place to be because it was such a melting pot in terms of different cultures and different countries. Like, I would go to a British grocery store. You know, like, there's an Indian grocery store. There was a, you know, local grocery store. I mean, like, there were so many different country influences. And I think it's even reflected in the people there as well.

And that, I thought, that's the coolest part about living abroad, is meeting people from all these different countries and different cultures and different backgrounds that you're not used to. I'm a big golfer, and my golf group, you know, was myself, an Italian guy, a British guy, a South African guy. So, it's like who's who of different countries. So, it was really cool.

[11:14]Brian Jackson: It's a real melting pot. So, I guess professionally, you know, living there, you're being challenged already, kind of, being pushed out of your boundaries, even just beyond the nine-to-five. What was the nine-to-five like?

[11:26]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, I wish it was nine-to-five. That would have been cool. I would say I'm the worst case study for careers in terms of nine-to-five. I don't think I've ever had a nine-to-five career yet. As a consultant, you know, as you talk with even people that go to Rice and get into consulting, you know, you do a lot. I was traveling every week. It was four days in a hotel, you know. And, like, a lot of times, you know, you work till midnight, maybe, or maybe you're done at, like, 7:00. It all depends on what you're working on.

But basically, as a consultant, I was with the client, and the hours are a little different for the client. So, they were there from 7:00 a.m. to 2:00 p.m. in the Middle East, because I mostly worked with Emirati clients. And then from, like, 2:00 p.m. onwards, I went, like, back to my hotel or back to my office, and we would, kind of, work as a team from there. The business language is English as well, which was interesting, very helpful for me. That's why I think so many people from all of these different countries could come to work in the Middle East.

But yeah, consulting, you know, is sitting with the client, doing a lot of PowerPoints and presentations, a lot of deliverables, advancing, kind of, the plan that you've set out, and meeting all these different milestones that you've promised the client. And then you've always got a little bit of BD on the side, business development and recruiting as well. You know, I used to do interviews as well for, you know, people trying to get into Kearney. But yeah, that was kind of a high-level view of the day-to-day.

[12:46]Brian Jackson: I mean, with your background of wanting to get projects pushed forward and get to a decision point, I mean, consulting's a perfect fit. You're seeing the problem of the client, you're giving them the solution, right? And implementing it. Is there a project that stood out to you in your time in Dubai?

[13:04]Chris Stillwell: There was one in particular. You know, we were helping to merge, kind of, two government organizations together, two, like, ministries into a single ministry. And so, that involved developing a Target Operating Model, meeting with clients. And, you know, it's kind of nerve-wracking sometimes when you're, you know, you're just this young guy going into meetings, and you're deciding the fate of an organization, even with headcount. You know, and you're deciding what the new organization's going to look like, what its roles, responsibilities, what's its mandates.

Obviously, you're not a decision-maker, but you're, you're facilitating that decision, and someone higher than you is making those decisions, especially on the client side. You know, that was just a very unique experience. You know, it was one of the first times I was exposed to, like, very senior people who were decision-makers in a country, and, like, it was going to make lasting impacts on how they were going to operate as a government.

[13:53]Brian Jackson: So, this being your first pivot, were there moments where there were, like, aha moments of, like, "Oh yeah, this makes sense. I know how to do this because of my previous experience in the military?”

[14:05]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, actually, to answer your question, but it was a very humbling moment for me. When I first joined consulting, I thought I was so great at PowerPoint because I had done all these PowerPoints in the military, you know, presenting to senior leaders and saying, "Look at these cool slides and maps that I used to, like, show." And then I get to consulting, and I had this manager who was like, "These are terrible slides. You need to do better." Then he obviously taught me how to do it better, but it was like, "Oh, there's actually an art to this PowerPoint thing."

And there's actually an art to how you structure a presentation and how you present to clients. And maybe in the military and a lot of other, maybe, corporate jobs, that art is not really practiced or understood. And I think consulting, and now even banking to an extent, really hone in on that skill. So, maybe that, kind of, answered your question, too. But, you know, it's definitely a…

[14:51]Brian Jackson: I mean, there's challenge with pivoting, and there's things that you think, yeah, I'm fantastic at doing this, but maybe not. Maybe it's an adjustment to a new language, and you pick it up. So, you're in Dubai, and you're thinking about the U.S., and you're thinking about an MBA. What pushed you to say, "Okay, this is it, now is the time?"

[15:09]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, so I initially, you know, wanted to stay only abroad for a year or two. You know, in the military, I had deployed. I had spent a lot of time away from home at training in the field, and I was, "Hey, I wasn't expecting to live abroad." COVID also hit while I was out there. And because of that, that actually extended my stay there as well, because things in Dubai actually were, kind of, better than America in terms of, like, golf was open, restaurants were open a lot earlier than it was in America. So, I, and I didn't really get some of the additional travel I wanted to do, like to Europe or Asia.

So, I wanted to stay until things opened up. And then when things opened up, it was great. I got to do that. But then I hit my three-year, kind of, almost close to my three-year mark, and I was like, "All right, I've done my time here. I want to go back to America. What are my options?" And I was weighing going back with my company and maybe pivoting. But I decided that I enjoyed consulting, but I really didn't enjoy living in a hotel four days a week anymore.

And then, when I was looking at careers and what to do, a lot of my colleagues, you know, consulting is a post-MBA job, and a lot of my colleagues had MBAs, and were telling me about it. And so, I was like, "All right, let me look into MBAs." And my picking of an MBA, I'm glad it worked out for me in terms of getting to Rice, but I really only wanted to go back to Texas or Florida because I lived in Texas before I came, and my family lives in Florida, and I like golfing. It's nice weather there all year round, and there's no taxes. So, lots of great things.

So, when I was looking at schools, Rice was the best school, ranking-wise, in terms of those two states. And I was like, "All right, let me just… I applied round one, so let me see if I get in. If I get in, good to go. If I don't get in, then I'll maybe look at some other schools." And I got in, and I was like, "Great." It was, like, December of '21, I got in. And I was like, "Great." And I gave my notice to my company, and, kind of, told them I wanted to leave around March timeframe. They were like, "Yep, no problem." So, stayed there for a couple more months, came back, and started my MBA career after that.

[17:01]Brian Jackson: Wow. So, beyond no taxation in the state of Texas and in our phenomenal ranking, was there anything specific about Rice that really drew you into it?

[17:11]Chris Stillwell: I was looking for some things like smaller classrooms, for example. Like a lot of people, we hire from Kearney, where, like, from Yale or HBS, and, like, their class size was like a thousand people. And, like, I think Rice, especially in the first term, really forces you to go to classes, to do your homework, to learn the materials.

And that was attractive to me as well, because I didn't come from a finance background at all. So, I didn't even know what a DCF was before I came through Rice. So, I was very grateful at that, you know, getting to Rice and realizing that it was such a good platform to be integrated into.

[17:43]Brian Jackson: For those who don't know, what is DCF?

[17:45]Chris Stillwell: DCF is Discounted Cash Flow, and it's the analysis, and it's basically a model to help understand the future cash flows of a company. And at the end of the day, you're arriving at an intrinsic value of what the company's worth.

[17:59]Brian Jackson: So, okay, you get to Rice. You jumped in, you got involved, you were in the Finance Association, you were the co-president, obviously, you were in the golf club, the Veterans Association, and the M.A. Wright Fund. You know, were you just trying to do a bit of everything to network and see where you wanted to go? What was the plan here?

[18:17]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, I think partially it, I think it's my background or my drive. I'm always someone who tries to get involved in things and be a part of clubs, and then maybe rise to leadership in clubs as well. You know, I did that in my undergrad. I do that now. I sit on, kind of, I'm involved in, like, on a board of a charity. And so, at Rice, I did an investment banking recruiting my first semester, and I felt like the Finance Association there did a fantastic job in training us, and prepping us, and mentoring us to get a banking job, to get us up to par in terms of the knowledge.

And so, I felt that, you know, and I then, obviously, I got an internship offer, and then when my second year started, I wanted to, kind of, give back to the organization, and I ran with my friend Jasper, who works at Wells Fargo, for co-president at the club. And we won. It was such a rewarding, I would say, second year, kind of, helping shape. Been the class below us, and even now I'm still friends with a lot of people who recruited even the year below us, and, kind of, still talk to them and run into them in the tunnels of downtown Houston.

[19:18]Brian Jackson: That's great. Yeah. The classmates are always the biggest part of the program, and the relationships you take afterwards as alumni. What part of this experience at Rice made the biggest impact on you?

[19:30]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, I mean, definitely getting a job, 100%. For sure.

[19:34]Brian Jackson: You took a giant leap here. So, that's fair answer.

[19:38]Chris Stillwell: But overall, I mean, like you go to get your MBA, one for a job, but two, it's also for networking and the connections you make. And I moved to a city where I knew nobody, to a school where I knew nobody, into a career where I knew nobody. And now I feel like it's almost really hard for, like, my mom still wants me to move back to Florida, and I think it'd be almost really hard for me to do that because I've made so many friends at Rice. I have friends that I go golfing with every weekend. I have friends that I, you know, every single bank pretty much in downtown, because we all recruited together.

I've just made friends through friends who've been in Houston for a long time. So, you know, you make this great network just going to Rice. And I feel like people at Rice, in particular, they take the work seriously, but not themselves, if that makes sense. Like, you find your good people at the end of the day.

[20:28]Brian Jackson: Folks are willing to work really hard. They're willing to share information, and I feel like people who take themselves too seriously are the ones who are competitive and not trying to maybe, you know, share the wealth.

[20:39]Chris Stillwell: Absolutely.

[20:40]Brian Jackson: So, I mean, this is basically you going into your next pivot, you know, going into investment banking. Was there, like now, an elevated sense of confidence of, "Okay, I've done this before. I'll do it again?”

[20:54]Chris Stillwell: Maybe some blind confidence sometimes. Yeah, you could even ask my parents. I went home for like four days for the Christmas break, the year I was recruiting, and I was, like, studying flashcards with my mom of all the IB 400 questions. And I was like, "I'm not going to get a job." You know, like, “All these people around me are much smarter than me. We've got a really talented pool of candidates that are recruiting this year.”

But, you know, I felt like at the end of the day, the Finance Association, and Rice, just the classes I took, really prepared me to understand, like, the basics of finance, the basics that are expected of the interview process, and then going forward. I saw when I started as an intern at the bank, I went to New York for a week. We were training with all these people from all these different schools, going to all these different groups in the bank. And some people didn't even know what a DCF was or, like, didn't know how to do it that well, I should say.

We were doing some practice problems, and I was like, "Wow, we're actually far ahead of a lot of these other schools and people." So, that was, kind of, good to see that, you know, Rice really put an effort into training us up. And nowadays, you know, I'm still involved with Rice in the recruiting process, just on the other side now. And, like, they have a bootcamp that they do where they train the students going into investment banking every weekend. They give them a different class that are taught by either bankers or teachers. They still have a mentorship program.

So, I think that Rice invests a lot of it into its students, that maybe some other schools, you'd just be a statistic.

[22:16]Brian Jackson: So, for folks who might want a career in investment banking and don't have your mother to help them with the flashcards, you would say the Rice program does a great job in helping them in the recruiting phases.

[22:27]Chris Stillwell: Absolutely. I mean, if you look at the, especially in Houston, you know, we got the proximity to the banks here. If you're recruiting into energy banking, Rice is one of the best schools to go to. We've had a great kind of placement program over the last decade or so. If you look at the number of bankers across the different banks in Houston, there's at least one or two Rice people at each bank.

[22:49]Brian Jackson: So, as an alumni, there's ways to volunteer after, right? And to come back and help students through recruiting.

[22:55]Chris Stillwell: Absolutely. I mean, there's I believe it was the year after me, the Finance Association started a mentorship program where not only they can help mentor MBA students that are getting into banking, but also undergrads that are getting into banking as well, because we also recruit analysts out of the undergrad population, and so they've partnered with the Rice Business Society and the undergrad school. We've also… You know, on the recruitment side, there's the IB Advisory Council where we work with the Career Development Office with Rice, and we help, kind of, set the rules every year.

We help advise them on what banks are looking for in terms of candidates, in terms of, like, the stats, GMAT score, stuff like that, we're looking at. But there's, I mean, there's so many ways to give back. So, it's been great.

[23:39]Brian Jackson: So, okay, you've got, you know, military consulting background, your MBA in pocket, you show up day one for your full-time job. What were you leaning on? What comes to mind of the skills that mattered and maybe the ones that you could have freshened up on?

[23:55]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, for sure. I mean, I think the skills that were a plus going into the job was consulting experience, 100% helped me, especially PowerPoint skills, interfacing with clients, navigating just the corporate structure, super helpful. From the military, just having that leadership presence and working with, you know, no understanding how to manage analysts and manage people above you as well.

 

But obviously, there's a lot of unknowns, I think, in investment banking as well. Maybe this is the scary part where it's like there's so many details, and there's so many things that you don't know, like how companies are structured, how to value them. You know, like, especially, I don't come from an energy background either, so I remember when I was at Rice, I was always asking my, like, petroleum engineer friends questions about the energy industry and how it works.

And then day one, you step in investment banking. It's not like they're secretly saying, here's this class you're going to take for one week on energy. It's like, "No, it's, you got to," they're going to start throwing acronyms at you. You just got to learn. And then you get staffed on five things, and you're like, "Okay, I don't know where I am, but I'm going to figure this out."

So, I leaned on a lot of things that, I guess, soft skills to help me, and then I had to really hone in on the hard skills to, kind of, bring me up to speed. And it really is learning by firehose. But, you know, I think that people who are successful, they show that they can actually absorb the information, work hard, and meet the expectations of the bank.

[25:18]Brian Jackson: So, you're at Bank of America, you're in the Natural Resources Energy Transition Group. So, what does your role look like? What does your day-to-day, kind of, seem? I know it's not nine-to-five.

[25:28]Chris Stillwell: Yeah, and, you know, that's kind of the cool thing. That's why I maybe have chosen the three careers that I've had so far, and now investment banking as well. There is no defined day. Every day is different, you know, it's very dynamic. You kind of, you do know obviously what you're going to do, but, like, it can change in the blink of an eye, and I find that exciting.

I really would hate to do the exact same thing every day. It would be like Groundhog Day, but instead, you know, like even today, I'm on a sell-side right now, so we're helping sell a company, and we had a bunch of management presentations where we're presenting the company to these select potential buyers. And that's a very interesting experience, because I'm sitting literally at a table across from a CEO of another company and listening to questions he has about the company that we're selling.

And that's, like, a really interesting thing for me. And then there's other times where it's like you're just trying to figure out why this number on these two slides don't tie and why they're different. You know, it's like there's very different elements of the job. I mean, there's a lot of people skills as well. You know, I think I really liked in the military as well, you're, kind of, given a task and not always kind of a guardrail of how to get that task accomplished or, like, a roadmap to do it.

And in banking, it's, kind of, similar, and a lot of times you, kind of, have to extend your influence outside of your, like, chain of command, for lack of a better term. And you've got to talk to people across different product groups, across different elements, the bank to get things done. You know, and that's, kind of, exciting to me too, because you get to talk to different people, meet different people as well. But yeah. And then sometimes you're just in the model, just building in a financial model, all these different Excel backups, and then outputting those things into a PowerPoint slide to make it more presentation-friendly for clients.

It's kind of eye-opening, and it's, kind of, interesting to see what risk tolerance some companies have versus other companies. What… You know, in the energy industry, like if you're talking about upstream, like where do they want to drill? Do they want to exit? Do they want to stay? What price points are they really sensitive to in terms of, like, future operations? It's interesting.

[27:35]Brian Jackson: If you had to give advice to folks thinking about a pivot, what would you, kind of, give to them to do it successfully?

[27:42]Chris Stillwell: Yeah. I think doing your research is the number one thing. I think just having an assumption or just looking at something at a very high level, like I'll use banking just as an example, but, like, if you look and you, like, say, "Oh, banking, you know, they make good salary, they make good bonus, I want to get into that." But then you don't do the research to see what is actually required for the recruitment process. I think it's very defined. Consulting is also a very defined recruitment process.

You have to meet all these little tick marks. You have to dress appropriately, you have to coffee chat. You have to meet the right people. Then there are other industries, you know, that even, like, out of an MBA, like, for example, venture capital or even marketing, where those recruitment pipelines are not well-defined, and it's mostly about networking. And so, what I'm, I guess, behind what I'm saying is, like, just do your research and, like, really understand if you want to pivot into a certain industry, understand how, what you have to do to get there.

And the best way to do that is obviously looking online, but also, you know, going to the right school and then reaching out to alumni or reaching out to people who are interning in that field and understanding how they did it.

[28:44]Brian Jackson: That's great. And I guess the other thing I think about, you've seen leadership in the Army, global consulting, and now banking. Has your definition of leadership evolved through each of these?

[28:56]Chris Stillwell: That's a good question. There are certain people who can be leaders and are very good at being leaders. But being a good leader in the military might not translate to being a good leader at banking. And a lot of times, you actually see that, or you see, like, military officers leave the military and go into the corporate world and not be as successful. Because I really think you do need to tailor your leadership style to, one, the industry you're working in, and two, the people you're working with, you know, different ways of operating motivate people differently.

Like in the military, you could yell at somebody and hold them to a higher standard, and maybe they'll do it. But, like, if you yelled at somebody in like, you know, a marketing job, they probably would shut down, and, like, that'd be the end of it. You know, like, it really doesn't work the same. The leadership style is something that you have to adjust to the area you're working in.

[29:43]Brian Jackson: That's great, and I think it's so true. If you started yelling at me through a Teams Channel, I'm going to just, I'm going to hang up.

[29:49]Chris Stillwell: Yeah.

[29:49]Brian Jackson: We're not going to get very far. So, in all of this, I mean, I know you're a big golfer, you know, is there something that you do to stay grounded to perform at your best?

[30:01]Chris Stillwell: I mean, you definitely need to de-stress, of course, and you got to have that social interaction. This is just my opinion. So, like, golfing is one of my outlets to do that, get to be outside, get to be with friends, get to challenge myself in something that, you know, is outside of work. And sometimes it's very frustrating, and sometimes it's very rewarding when you hit a good shot. But just hanging out with friends, hanging out with family, is also important to me.

Working out, traveling, and seeing new places and new people, all great stuff for me. And then maybe occasionally binge-watching some TV when you have time.

[30:36]Brian Jackson: You ever hit a hole in one?

[30:40]Chris Stillwell: I wish. That's still in the cards for me. Hopefully one day.

[30:45]Brian Jackson: Okay. You've got a long career in golf ahead of you, so maybe it'll happen.

[30:48]Chris Stillwell: Yes.

[30:49]Brian Jackson: So, when you think of the next few years out, are there, like, specific challenges or opportunities that you're excited about, to take on?

[30:57]Chris Stillwell: The interesting thing about my career, even currently, there is an element to progression. You know, there is a defined path, and with each positions, your job changes completely. You know, you're still, obviously, have to do the basic skills of the job and understand how finance works and how energy works and whatever. But then VP, you start to blend client interaction and business development with, also, reviewing the work and making sure it gets done.

And managing director, it's, like, mostly building that business development, giving it strategic advice to clients. So, it is, kind of, exciting that, like, my life will always continue to change. It's not going to be, like, set in stone, I'm going to be in the same job forever, doing the exact same thing. So, that's always exciting for me.

[31:39]Brian Jackson: You pick the right field to grow into, and there's plenty of opportunity in the different levels that might be ahead of you.

[31:45]Chris Stillwell: Exactly.

[31:46]Brian Jackson: So, for anyone listening who's considering an MBA as a part of their career pivot trajectory, especially veterans or career switchers, what's one piece of guidance you'd want to leave them with?

[31:58]Chris Stillwell: I would say, you know, pick the program about plug and Rice. Hopefully, Rice is your program. They choose. But, you know, pick the program that makes the best sense for the career that you're choosing.

I didn't come from an energy background and I really learned so much about energy just taking these different classes at Rice, like geopolitics of energy or energy and transition, and going to refs as well. And, you know, I wouldn't have gotten that experience at maybe other schools.

[32:22]Brian Jackson: Well, Chris, first, thank you for your service. Really appreciate it. And also thank you for joining me on Owl Have You Know for sharing your story. This has just been a great conversation.

[32:32]Chris Stillwell: Yeah. No, it's been great. Thank you, Brian. I really appreciate, you know, being chosen and being on here as well. Thank you again.

[32:41]Brian Jackson: Thanks for listening. This has been Owl Have You Know, a production of Rice Business. You can find more information about our guests, hosts, and announcements on our website, business.rice.edu. Please subscribe and leave a rating wherever you find your favorite podcast. We'd love to hear what you think. The hosts of Owl Have You Know are myself, Brian Jackson, and Maya Pomroy.