Failing Forward feat. Ben Clemenceau ’21

[00:00] Intro: Welcome to Owl Have You Know, a podcast from Rice Business. This episode is part of our Pivot Series, where guests share stories of transformation in their lives and careers.

[00:12] Maya: On this live episode of Owl Have You Know, we meet Ben Clemenceau, professional MBA of 2021. Ben shares with us what he has been up to since he graduated. His pivot for market research to consulting, and we also explore his unique family background and how it’s shaped the leadership qualities he has today. We touch on his love of fast cars and his passion for the Houston community. 

Hello, and welcome to Owl Have You know, I'm your host, Maya Pomroy. Today, we have a wonderful alumni guest, Ben Clemenceau, who is a professional MBA from the class of 2021.

Ben, thank you so much for being with us here today.

[00:53] Ben: Thank you so much for having me.

[00:55] Maya: Here in McNair, taping on the building in the premises at Rice University, which is fantastic. So, you have had quite the journey and quite the pivot in your career since you graduated in 2021. And it's been accelerated significantly. So, tell me about how Rice has really catapulted you from where you were to where you are today.

[01:18] Ben: Yeah, great question. And I like the word, "catapulted." I always said that Rice acts like a springboard. The MBA acts like a springboard. And it, and it's a great thing for people. So, when I joined, I was working in oil and gas. I'd been doing that for about eight years. I was primarily in a corporate market research function. And I was working a lot with the C-suite, and I gained a certain appreciation for working with the C-Suite. I think that the way that they approached problems was extremely logical and objective. And I knew I wanted to change what track I was on and move away from strategic marketing while still preserving some of that with regards to the people that I worked with and then the way of working.

Very quickly, you know, you start your MBA recruiting kicks off bright and early. And I thought, why not go for an internship somewhere? Consulting was the first thing that popped up. And it made sense, you know. You get the opportunity to take a step back, taste-test a lot of different industries, and get a feel for how they work, get a feel for how the people in those industries think about problems.

And it was a great thing to chase some of my favorite classes at Rice, because I think, as soon as I hit the ground with immersion week, I was in Dr. Haiyang Li's strategy class. And it was one-week intensive learning, lots of cases, but you're learning about all these different businesses and radically different industries. And there are challenges. Some are challenges that seem impossible to come back from. Others seem easy, but they're tricky.

So, consulting, sort of, teased, hey, that kind of stuff, if you like that, keep going with it. And you can join us, and give it a shot. So, I went through consulting, recruiting. It's intensive. It's exciting. It's competitive. And I made it. I joined Accenture Strategy, did the internship with them, loved it, and went all in on on Accenture. I'm a little over a year in now and have, yes, gotten promoted recently, which has been a thrill. And that has been just a massive pivot. I'm still getting to work with that executive audience. The problem-solving is very much that, sort of, logical fact-based problem-solving that I appreciated. But I'm so far now from market research. And the kinds of work I've done over the last one and a half, you could call it two if you threw in the internship years, has really been more varied than I could have imagined, and so stimulating.

[03:42] Maya: In what way?

[03:04] Ben: Well, you know, one day you're working with a client who wants to bring digital to their entire organization and overhaul the commercial side of their business and the supply chain side of their business. And those are massive undertakings.

[03:15] Maya: No, real underachievers that really want to do that, I’m just saying.

[03:45] Ben: Yeah, right, exactly. And then, the next day, you've got a client come to you, and they say, "Blank check, we need to acquire a new company in this space that we're brand new to. How do we do it? Who do we look at? What sorts of entry factors do we consider? What are the psychologies of the leaders in that field that we might be approaching for, for purchase? And how do we approach them and make an enticing offer?" And so, you're always kept on your toes, you're always learning new things. And I think that flexibility and curiosity that it calls on from me has been an exciting thing to practice.

[04:16] Maya:So, let's dig into the professors here at Rice. So, you mentioned Professor Li. And I took that strategy class as well when I was here at Rice. So, tell me your experience with him and how rich of an experience that was, and really, what the professors here at Rice, how they activate parts of you that you don't even know exist.

[04:38] Ben: I think all of them do an excellent job at teaching a particular business instinct. You know, depending on what career you go into after your MBA or depending on what transition you're making, if you, if you remain in your current career through the MBA, some classes are, just by nature, going to be more or less useful or immediately applicable to you than others. But what they all do, regardless of that application, is they teach that instinct. And, you know, from the get-go, for me, as a, as a PMBA, Dr. Li was my introduction to the program. So, I think, you know, not only was that an ice bath that I jumped into that first week, it was a lot of late nights, a lot of case reading and everything.

[05:15] Maya: Yes.

[05:16] Ben: But he does it well. And I think he, kind of, encapsulates that Rice professor and what the values are there. He challenges you. He makes sure that you know what you're talking about and that you can cite what your claims come from within the cases. But, at the same time, I think he does a really good job rewarding creative answers, rewarding outside-the-box thinking. And he also does an incredible job, and this is another thing that I think all the professors have been so good at, he will encourage students to engage each other.

[05:45] Maya: Yes.

[05:46] Ben: Not just him. And that's, and that's so valuable, because if you give an idea, if he says, why might a company have done this, or, what should the company do, and you give your answer, he will then look around the room. He won't betray his emotion, his answer. He'll say, "What do you think?" And he wants somebody to, kind of, you know, fight you a little bit on it and to push back or to agree with you. And it's rare that you can get away with a silly answer without another student jumping at it and taking that chance to say, "Hey, I read the material, and I'm hungry for this, too." But I think he fosters that atmosphere brilliantly.

[06:17] Maya: And then, you have that debate.

[06:19] Ben: Oh, it's great. It's great.

[06:20] Maya: It is. It is. And then, and then you start thinking about things in a completely different way. And that's really part of what I adore about the program, is that you not only get to have phenomenal top-of-the-line professors here at Rice, but also, your cohort and the people that are in your classes and to see different perspectives based on their own backgrounds and expertise. And everybody's there because they are hungry, as you mentioned, to get to the next level and to get to the next step in the next chapter in their life.

And that energy, also, from Professor Li, I think that he's got this dynamic energy where it's palpable. When you're sitting in the class, you know, it's not just to sit and lecture and take notes and, you know, read the material. "I'm going to ask you questions to make sure that you read," right?

[07:10] Ben: Those strategy professors, they get their steps on their, on their smartwatches. They're patrolling the rooms. They're up and down the steps. And it's great.

[07:17] Maya: Yeah. So, if someone is considering Rice, what would you tell them about Rice that's unique and different from any other program? Because clearly, you looked at other programs before choosing Rice, and we'll get to that in a second.

[07:33] Ben: Sure. You know, Rice, I think something that Rice does really well, one of the questions when I was applying was, what is unconventional wisdom to you? And I recall the gist of my answer, but I remember thinking about that for a long time, because if a school asks you a question like that on your entry, that means it's going to be something that they care a lot about.

And there's a lot of conventional wisdom in the business world. There's a lot of constructive and well-laid-out information on the web that can teach you how to approach certain business challenges and situations, well, even. And I think people who self-teach in that regard can learn a lot. But it's not a catch-all, and I think it misses something. And this goes back to the instinct that I talked about earlier.

When you think about the unconventional wisdom that Rice teaches, it's, sort of, a reprogramming in the way that you approach some of these fundamental business truisms and these processes and rules that are taught in accounting and in data and all these things. You've got to learn that framework and that base. But to go further is to craft somebody into a, sort of, an interesting leader of a multi-varied leader. And you find yourself suddenly thinking more critically, and you find yourself searching for the, sort of, what else? And whenever you might come to an answer on a problem, you're suddenly, and this is taught in org behavior and so many other classes, you're trained to say, "Okay, well, is this really it? Are there other alternatives? Are there other potential things lying under the surface that I might have missed in just chasing this basic framework?" So, I think Rice does an excellent job at training that instinct and teaching people to, not just follow, I think, what the conventional wisdom is. And that's really helped, especially, in my trade of work.

[09:18] Maya: And so, in terms of your cohort, can you tell me a bit about your cohort and what the composition was and how many of those new best friends that you're still in touch with and that community piece that's also part of Rice?

[09:31] Ben: Absolutely. My team is like family to me. I'm actually in a couple months going to the one-year-old birthday of their child. So, so exciting. And I do keep in touch with as many as I can. I'm back on campus as often as I can be, and plugged into all the alumni groups.

So, I love my cohort. We started a year before COVID, or well I should say a semester before COVID. And we really got to know each other in person and got to experience Rice in, sort of, all that it is. And they were a great healthy mix of people with engineering backgrounds, of people with business backgrounds. And then, you had people with teaching backgrounds and with theater backgrounds and all of these different, sort of, walks of life contributing to the school meant that you had a diverse set of views to build your classes on. Especially, in my class, I felt like I learned nearly as much from my peers and from their responses to questions and challenges that I did at my professor. And that's definitely not a dig at the professor. That's really because the people are fantastic. I was surrounded by such strong peers.

And I enjoyed feeling like I was, maybe, not the smartest person in the room. I was, like, behind a little bit. And then, I had to play catch-up with these folks. They were inspirational. So, I enjoyed that. I enjoyed their competition when we were all recruiting for the same. And I definitely still stay in touch. I think it's great. I came here knowing that I love Houston. I'm from Houston. And to be able to come back to this campus and to see familiar faces, and even to just run into them at restaurants and networking events and corporate events, has been so, so rewarding.

[11:04] Maya: And that's something that you learn once arrive to Rice.

[11:06] Ben: Yes.

[11:07] Maya: So, that's also something, when I was applying for the program, that wasn’t something that… I mean, I was like, yes, I'm going to meet some new people, but I'm going to get all this great knowledge, and I'm going to further my career, and all that, but then you... it changes you.

So, let's go back to why you chose Rice. You went to Millsaps for your bachelor's of business administration. And you are a native Houstonian, born and raised, but with a background in history, a really unique and rich history, where your family is from France. We'll get to that in a second. But I do want to talk about why you chose Rice. Was it because you are from Houston and it's, kind of, one of these, you know, meccas that you drive by when you live here and you're like, "It would be great to go there?" It's really hard to get into, but, you know, maybe was that always a goal for you? Or, was it something different that really stood out?

[11:53] Ben: Great question. And I think that's part of it. Driving by it, I went to, as a, as a really little kid, all of my, what, K to 8 experience was over in the Museum District. And so, I was always nearby.

[12:05] Maya: Around the corner.

[12:05] Ben: Right around the corner, right around the corner, a few blocks from campus. And it's a beautiful campus. I hear so much about it. And Rice contributes so much to Houston, both in intellectual capital and creative capital. I grew up going to the symphony, and there's so many people from the Shepherd School. And when I drive by campus, I'd see people who didn't look at all like students. I assume they’d be parents or something with young children playing and throwing Frisbees and stuff on campus. And it felt like a community.

And so, that combined with the fact that, yes, it's a competitive school, I wanted a competitive school, I wanted to be part of the Rice ecosystem, however that might be, it turned out for me that was business. And it so happened to be that Rice's MBA program is also one of the stronger MBA programs, so...

[12:44] Maya: In the country.

[12:45] Ben: In the country, in the country.

[12:47] Maya: Actually, the world, now that there is a Rice presence in France.

[12:51] Ben: Absolutely, which is fantastic. I feel like I attended the school maybe a year or two too soon. I would love to visit that. However, yes, global footprint, every time the rankings come out, I'm happier than I was before. So, it's great. Really, I think it's a combination of the fact that it's a competitive serious school, but still a force for good through its contributions to the arts, through the programs, the scholarships and tuition assistance that they provide, to make a difference in people's lives, even through their contributions to things like the Ion Innovation Center.

[12:38] Maya: Absolutely.

[12:58] Ben: I think those kinds of things are exciting. It's clear that they will train you well. But it's also... it's very apparent that they are a good citizen, not just of Houston, but of the United States and beyond.

[13:38] Maya: Yeah, absolutely. So, what other schools did you look at?

[13:41] Ben: I looked all over the place. I looked around Texas. I looked at some of the biggest in Texas, largely at their satellite programs in Houston. But I did consider moving to other cities. I actually looked in Europe. My cousin was at INSEAD. And I loved the school, I loved the program. Ultimately, you know, I think Rice being two years was appealing to me because I really did want to dive back into academia and immerse myself. I looked up at the northeast. And, you know, I really decided, in addition to everything I've already said, I was out of state already for undergrad. I would love to be back here to be home, my home city where I feel like I know every blocks.

[14:17] Maya: So, your childhood. So, let me... this is really, really cool. Your great, great grandfather was the prime minister of France during World War I.

[13:59] Ben: Yes.

[14:00] Maya: And so, your family is French and you're a dual citizen. So, you're a U.S. and a French citizen. So, tell me about that. That's fantastic.

[14:35] Ben: I am. You've done your research. So, yes, my father was born in Bordeaux at the start of World War II. He's got this incredible story where his grandfather was in the French Army and his grandmother was with newborn dad, and they were fleeing the country because the blitzkrieg was going on and the, and the Germans were pushing in. And they fled the country with whatever, you know, valuables and clothing that they could and chartered a boat to Senegal. And so, my father spent the first three years of his life in Dakar, Senegal. The Wolof Tribe helped raise him. And he's got this incredible story before they came to the United States. And so, the family history in France, it goes far back. But yes, my great, great grandfather, he was the prime minister. He was prime minister twice.

[15:14] Maya: Twice.

[15:15] Ben: Once in the early 1900s, and then, again, in the 1910s during the war. He was very much a Winston Churchill before Churchill. I think Churchill was a fan of his. And a lot of his quotes were English translations of [inaudible 00:15:03] quotes. And he's a very fascinating character. He's a, he's a selfless character. He was all about France and victory. And they call him Father Victory, The Tiger, the… all sorts of great names. And he was so selfless that, you know, there are all of these great stories in books about him and in personal writings that are, sort of, a role model to live up to. And it's...

[15:53] Maya: Big shoes to fill.

[15:54] Ben: Well, yeah, almost unfillable shoes. They're incredible. But it does hit different when it's family and when you can visit places in France where you know you've got a real family footprint. It's special.

[16:06] Maya: So, do you have hopes of ever moving to France and having that be your home? Or, is Houston where you're going to stay? I guess you don't know, but would you want to?

[16:16] Ben: Things could change. I'm so loyal to Houston. I love it here. And I do a lot of volunteer work in the area to try to help build a community here. And so, I don't think I could ever truly leave Houston. But boy, would I love to have a little place over there to get away to sometimes? During the summer, June, July, August, spend some time over in France, wouldn't be too bad.

[16:32] Maya: Yeah, no, I agree. I think it would be great. And let's talk about you giving back to Houston, because you actively are a member of The Menil Collection and the Museum of Natural Science. You also do quite a bit of mentoring to peers within the schools that you went to when you were in middle school and upper school, and also with Millsaps, which is where you went for college. So, tell me why you do that, why do you feel that it is important to really give back as much as you can, not only to the city, but to be a mentor?

[17:04] Ben: Sure. You know, I think community is everything and the community's only as strong as the effort that its members put into it. And so, Houston, you know, we want a strong arts scene, we want a strong sciences and education scene. We want green and nice parks. And so, I think it's very valuable to get involved in those organizations, help in whatever capacity you can. And so, I've got the business background. And now, being in consulting, I've worked with a breadth of clients. And I can, sort of, parse out these interesting challenges and come up with curious solutions.

So, working in that capacity, I've gone to these organizations as, sort of, a committee member to help fundraising, to help organize events to raise awareness for things. And then, like you said, mentorship, I think that's another important thing. So, going back to the places that you come from, where you know you've got some shared DNA there. I know what it's like to go to First Presbyterian School and Episcopal High School and Millsaps College. And I know the kinds of values that they instill in people. I'm speaking somewhat of the same language, going back to them.

And so, whether it be working to connect graduating alumni to the professional world or to answer big life questions and try to make some big scary things a little less scary to people who are feeling it in the moment, I'm more than thrilled to do it.

[18:20] Maya: That's wonderful. Are there any other organizations that you're curious about getting involved with here in Houston? There's quite a few, new ones that are popping up. Like you mentioned the Ion.

[18:30] Ben: Exactly, yeah, the list is endless. The Ion is definitely one. I've been attending some events at Greentown Labs, which is, which is big on sustainability, and very interested in that. Healthcare is an area that I have not touched as much as I would like to get involved in. And there are a lot of great foundations and organizations there that work for all the right causes. So, definitely.

[18:49] Maya: So, we're going to, we're going to pivot a little bit and talk about your pivot. So, tell me about your... some of your successes. And I also want to know about your failures and why you decided to pivot when you did.

[19:03] Ben: Definitely. I'll start with the successes because I think those were immediately apparent. It was really, really great to be able to join the program and think to myself, I'm free to make mistakes. This is a space in which I can experiment with new career paths, experiment with new curricula, that I might be... you know, I might, I might have had a rocky start with the last time I engaged them. And I can take leaps with recruiting, with building new networks that, maybe, I wouldn't want to when I'm in a stable job and wanting to play it safe.

And so, I think that paid off pretty immediately. You know, you get out of something, what you put into it. And wherever that is, community, which is kind of what I was talking about earlier, and even when it comes to education in the MBA, I think you get out of it what you put into it. If you're a smart person and you fight and you get into Rice, I think you can excel in the school. But if you really pour your heart into it, you can get so much more. You can squeeze that, sort of, last 5, 10% of material out of it and get something meaningful there.

And so, success is, you know, I think I went about trying to do that early, and that yielded a great offer from an excellent firm. And I really, I think, by the time I was done with my first semester, kind of, had a lot of what I wanted to get out of the MBA already finished. I had, sort of, tied a bow on it, and that was it. And the rest of the MBA, got to spend three semesters enjoying it, taking whatever classes I wanted and spending time doing other things, like being a TA and joining the Athena Group and some of these admissions ambassadorships and such. So, that was great. But again, you know, like you said, you know, there will be failures. And that's often where we learn the most.

[20:15] Maya: Absolutely.

[20:45] Ben: I think, you know, it is a challenge to balance all of those ambitions and all of those things when you really want to pour your heart into it. There are so many clubs to join. There are so many organizations to get involved in. There are so many different classes that you could possibly sign up for. And especially, as a PMBA, when I was working, you know, you're trying to balance all of that at the same time. And then, you've got, what, family to be concerned about and everything else. So, there's a lot on your plate at once.

And it's a very, very sneaky thing. It can, it can surprise you. You'll find yourself in over your head, and that you've bitten off more than you could chew. And there were a few times where you know you falter. And you might falter in important areas where you don't want to. And so, for me, that meant during the recruiting process when I was trying to juggle all of these things and I joined, like, 10 clubs and was so involved. And here I was, trying to compete with people who were taking recruiting so seriously. They were 100% devoted to it. They put everything else on hold. And they went all in on recruiting. And so, for a moment there, I got, I got scared because I was walking into these coffee chats with consultancies. And here were these students saying they were walking out and they were saying, "Oh, yeah, it was great playing squash with you the other weekend, you know. We'll catch up another time." And I pulled the guy aside and I said, "You guys longtime friends or something?" He goes, "No, no, no. This is our fourth or fifth coffee chat by now. Last one, we did over a squash game." And I'm thinking, this is my first, what?

[22:05] Maya: You're playing squash?

[22:06] Ben: Yeah. And so, and so that was a wake-up call. And that was a bit sobering. And so, you'll have those moments. But again, it's a place where you can make those mistakes. It's a place where you can fail a little bit and you fail forward. And so, my moment for that was, okay, I'm going to go in 110%. I started a case competition that was my first case competition ever. It was hosted by one of the major consultancies that was recruiting. I built a team. And we won it. We not only won it, but we won it well enough that we were invited to go to the nationals, which was the first time that Rice was ever invited to go to the Nationals for that competition. So, that was a great, again, lesson learned and failing forward that led to this exciting success, which guaranteed the whole team interviews. And we got some fun prizes and stuff, too.

[22:50] Maya: What competition was it?

[22:52] Ben: That was the Deloitte Case Competition.

[22:54] Maya: And what were the prizes?

[22:55] Ben: Well, you know, it was, it was a, it was a myriad of things, but, you know, I got this pair of headphones, these like little earbuds that you can talk to and issue commands to that I still use today. So, probably, one of the more useful things that I got.

[23:08] Maya: Fail it forward, I love that. That's something that's going to... I'm going to tuck that in my pocket and definitely use that for myself. Fail it, or fail it forward.

[23:18] Ben: Failing forward, yeah.

[22:51] Maya: Failing forward, that's perfect. What would you say is the most challenging aspect of your, of your new role? Tell us about your new role and what it all entails and the biggest challenges you're facing right now.

[23:32] Ben: Yeah, great question. So, the new role, it's interesting. So, in consulting, your exact role, the nature of your work changes project to project. And when you join the firm that I'm with, in particular, we have several unofficial tracks that people can follow.

[23:47] Maya: At Accenture?

[23:47] Ben: At Accenture. And you start to see people who want to explore a lot. And so, they linger in a generalist position and they try a lot of different areas. You see people who are subject matter experts, and they go all-in on something. Whatever that means for the pace of their career, they love that material.

You also have people who want fast growth. And that's what I was going for. From day one, I thought I want to make managers as fast as I can. And so, I started taking stretch roles. Whatever project I was on, I wanted to find projects where I was specifically taking on a manager's role.

And so, to answer your question, my work hasn't changed too much, because the last year or so, I've been doing mostly manager work. But what that looks like on a day-to-day, if an engagement that we sell involves some solution, that solution is usually drafted and operated and managed by a sort of top echelon of leaders. Your partners, or, in our case, managing directors, and the senior managers. Within the project, you've got work streams. And these verticals, these columns are different elements of the solution needed to make it work.

And so, those are usually run by managers, and that's where I sit. I will have beneath me a team of consultants and/or analysts that are working together to crunch the numbers, find out how to make this work, and to develop the solution. And that is an exciting position to be in, because oftentimes, you're, sort of, called to work in both directions. You're working on the ground with your analysts and consultants, making sure those numbers look right, making sure that everything is solid and sound and client-ready.

But on the flip side, you're privy, you're a fly on the wall sometimes to those leadership conversations, which is such a really, really unique and cool place to be. You're there helping sell the work. You're there making... informing the critical decisions on, when can this solution be ready? Or, where does this project go next? What future work can we sell? What future problems can we solve with this client? Especially, if it's a, if it's a larger account. So, it's a very cool position to be in. It's the coolest kind of work that I've ever done. But again, I think I said this much earlier, it really does require flexibility and curiosity, because sometimes projects shift on a dime and all of the hard work and the research that you've done and the hypothesis that you've tested and proven and that you've taken to them and that you're ready for is no longer valid. Or, maybe, there's new disruptive information and you have to go back to square one.

And that can be frustrating, but you very quickly learn that, with those kinds of things, no hard feelings and no frustration. It's all just an exercise in curiosity and openness. And it works for us. It works better for your client. And so, I think it's a win-win when you can adapt in that way. But that's, kind of, what I've been doing for about a year now.

[26:33] Maya: So, tell me about you being a mentor to others. And first of all, I want to know who your mentors are, who they were for you when you were young and as you grew, and who they are now, and the importance of mentorship.

[26:45] Ben: Yeah. I find mentors everywhere. I look for mentors everywhere. And I think that, in the pursuit of a well-rounded life, you almost have to find mentors to help you in each of those different areas. And sometimes, you find mentors that are so impressive and incredible that they will impact multiple areas of your life. And in other cases, they really do specialize, and they show you the path to walk for some specific thing. So, you know, I find multifaceted mentors in my parents, of course, and somewhat reading about family history and some of the characters that came before me, I think, in a way, they don't really speak back, but they mentor me in how they behaved and what their actions were.

But more actively, I... there were a few that really, really did change my life. I had a communications professor in undergrad who really showed me how to think critically and fairly and empathetically. And that has served me. And where so many people are now prizing EQ and the power of empathy, this guy, I feel like he was ahead of the curve. And he put me in, I think, a very advantageous position. And that helped professionally when working with some of the stakeholder groups that I worked with, learning how to communicate with empathy.

Beyond that, one of my managers back when I was in the oil sector was an incredible force. He was the leader and the leader who really showed how to lead from the, from the pack, you know. And there are a lot of, sort of, buzzwords and ways to describe this, but ultimately he's the promoter, the one who lifts those up around him, and inspires them to work, makes them want to do better. And he did such an incredible job with that. He is one of... Actually, I didn't mention this earlier, but he's one of the reasons that I chose Rice. He was a Rice MBA. And he embodied everything that I wanted to be. And so, I thought, gosh, if this guy's coming from that program, I should take a look at it. And he actually... you know, even we'd take a day out of our... or an hour out of our day. We, actually, at one point, worked a joint project with Rice University, with the MBA program. I think it was Vikas Mittal, Professor Mittal.

[28:47] Maya: Yes, I had him as well.

[28:49] Ben: Okay. He helped sponsor a study within my organization. I was working with Cameron International, the big oil company before we were required by Schlumberger. And when we would come back to campus, my manager at the time, Craig, would help me, you know, sneak around campus and take a look. And he'd say, "This is where I studied. This is where I had this class." And that left a mark. That definitely inspired me.

And then, I think more recently, I found a very well-rounded mentor in the manager that was previously on my project. I was, sort of, her understudy before I took over. And she was, sort of, all-in-one. She was leadership. She was the empathy piece in communications. And she was, sort of, this fearlessness, too, that I hadn't had yet. No matter what challenge was thrown at us, no matter what sort of issue might arise, you know, you want to perform for your client. And when something is disrupted, it's a scary thing walking into a client call, armed only with, "Oh, guys, here's this new problem, and..."

[29:49] Maya: "We have to fix it."

[29:49] Ben: "This might set us back. We've got to be careful." She was totally fearless. And she always found ways to look for positivity and to look for something, some shred of hope to cling to. And that sort of stoic nature that she had stuck with me. She's off the project now. She's onto something new, but I stay in touch with her regularly. And I think, you know, having somebody like that where I can now take issues to her and I can say, "Hey, this thing is really stressing me out," and she gives me a plain, straightforward, and honest and intelligent answer. And so, I definitely cherish that. But, you know, that's a lot of people. And I think that there's nothing wrong with that, right? I think that it is important to have as many mentors as you can and to just know what they're bringing you, so that whenever you do talk to them, you can really seek to get the most out of that conversation.

[30:38] Maya: And what kind of a mentor do you choose to be to your mentees?

[30:43] Ben: You know, I hope that they have good things to say about me, because I feel sometimes they walk in and they bring these problems to me and I'm like, "Oh, you know what? That's actually pretty stressful. You're right." And so, you know, you've got to find a way to be a mentor, to be strong, and to try to find what's that wisdom you're going to impart to them.

[30:59] Maya: Unconventional wisdom.

[31:00] Ben: And, what's that? Unconventional wisdom. And oftentimes, you know, I'm young, and I feel sometimes, am I really... is it right for me to think that I could give that wisdom? I think, ultimately, it boils down to being honest. And if nothing more, then maybe I'm that mentor that shows them that, no matter what, honesty can be a real weapon in the arsenal. I think, you know, really, what that teaches people is that honesty can be a really good tool in that toolkit. And I find that, when listening to their concerns and trying to think about what to say, it's less, how do I frame this thing? It's more, how can I just be real with them?

[31:34] Maya: How can you be real with them? Well, that's all that anybody really wants, right?

[31:40] Ben: Exactly.

[31:41] Maya: So, it's probably something that people don't know about you. You did voice overacting. And you mentioned that communications professor that you had.

[31:48] Ben: Yes, yes.

[32:11] Maya: Was that really the door that was open for you to do voiceover work?

[31:54] Ben: You would think so, but he was actually way more focused on, sort of, the philosophy and psychology of communications. I found the voice-acting thing totally by random. I was, I was, like, looking around for new computer parts to put into this computer I was building. And I couldn’t…

[32:11] Maya: Wait, I'm sorry. You were building a computer?

[32:13] Ben: Yes.

[32:14] Maya: Oh, wait, we missed that part. So, wait, let's back up. Wait a minute. So, wait, when were you building a computer?

[32:19] Ben: Oh, since I was a kid, since I was a kid. Whenever... My dad got me this Windows 95 computer when I was a kid. It was for me and my brother. And he put it in the hallway. And we would tinker with it. And we were always in awe of technology and what was going on. And we would always find ways to break it.

And so, he would call up our tech guy, and the guy would come over. And sometimes, it was just software work. But what really got me was when he would pop the side of the case open and start pulling out the wires and all the circuitry and stuff. And it... you know, I loved Legos as a kid. And I started seeing these big plugs that were basically the next evolution of Legos to me. And so, I started looking into it and realized it's really not much more complicated than that.

And I started building computers, be it for gaming or video editing, or even just for fun. I'd build them for other friends of mine. I got into it. And so, when I couldn't find reviews on online for this particular computer part, I was like, "Man, somebody needs to do that." So, I talked to a buddy of mine and he started up a little video channel. And he put together this script that basically reviewed this part that we didn't see any reviews for. And he said he didn't like the sound of his voice, it was awkward, that I should do it. And I gave it a shot. We listened to it. He was like, "This is cool." Now, mind you, I was young and I think I was even going through puberty at the time. So, it was like all over the map. And it wasn't so great.

But eventually, you know, I stuck with it. I started to do it with the company that I was working for with Cameron. We would do instructional videos for oil field engineers, how to install these massive several-ton pieces of equipment. And I would narrate the script for that. I auditioned for some book narration and even some cartoon characters that had some pretty crazy voices, so, the whole spectrum. And it's been a blast. I really do enjoy being in the sound room.

[34:07] Maya: Can you do some of those voice? I'm just kidding. I'm not going to make you do that. No, that's fascinating that… I mean, wow, what a, what a ride, so far. And so much, you know, just the beginning, right? You also... some of your other hobbies is you like race cars.

[34:23] Ben: I love race cars. I'm also good at breaking those, but...

[34:28] Maya: Well, I love race cars, too. So, we share that in common.

[34:30] Ben: Racing of all kinds, I grew up, whenever we'd go to France, we'd spend most of our summers in France. I feel, as a kid, I remember so many trips there. It's hard to count. And we would always be there in time for Le Mans, the 24-hour endurance race. And it was a very affectionate relationship with cars. My dad had a fast car when I was growing up and a convertible.

[34:49] Maya: What did he have?

[34:50] Ben: He had this convertible 1969 or '68 Porsche Targa GT or something like that.

[34:56] Maya: Does he still have it?

[34:57] Ben: No, he sold it, but —

[34:58] Maya: Oh, no.

[34:59] Ben: … it's great because he sold it to some random person. And something like 12, 15, 16 years later, he gets an email or a call from this little old family in Germany, near Stuttgart, near the facility where he bought it fresh off the assembly line while he was living in Europe. And they were collecting old Porsches and restoring them to their original state. And they had his car. They found his name and an old address or something scribbled into the owner's manual.

[35:26] Maya: Really?

[35:26] Ben: And they tracked them down, and they said, "We've etched it back to its original paint job. We've found the original floorboards. One of the mirror flaps were broken. And so, we replaced the mirror and the flap with the OEM and everything like that." And it was a really special thing. I think he was excited to see his baby, kind of, make it back into good hands who would restore it well.

[35:45] Maya: What a sort of really cool story.

[35:48] Ben: Yeah. And that was a special car, too. And it's one I grew up in and with the... much to my mother's chagrin, the top-down through Houston and the nice weather sometimes, we'd be cruising. And he led me to this racing class one time. After driver's ed, he said, "No, I want you to really learn what it feels like to lose control of a car.

[36:05] Maya: When you were 15?

[36:06] Ben: When I was 16, actually. He took me to a skid pad. And they hose down the track. And they had me drive in a big loop going quite fast. And then, the passenger wrenched the wheel out of my hand and put us into a spin and just started saying, "Steer, counter steer, counter steer, like, fix it, fix it, fix it." And I righted the vehicle. And he had me do that 10 or 11 times. And we tested the limits of the car. And it was a thrill.

So, I got into driving fast, which turned into racing. And in college, and for a year... a couple years after that, I would find any excuse to race. I had this little BMW that I would drive. I had friends who had cars that I could borrow. Nowadays, unless —

[36:44] Maya: Those are nice friends.

[36:44] Ben: They're trusting friends, but we were young and stupid. So, nowadays, it's, you know, unless you're sponsored, it's tough. So, I love kart racing. And actually, I've been recruiting on behalf of Accenture a bunch of the Rice MBAs. And you get to meet so many cool smart students when you're, when you're doing that, but you also get to meet potential competitors for the racetrack. And I've found a group of guys who they love it as much as I do. They’d Formula 1 race every single weekend. So, I think we're going to try to have a track day sometime soon.

[37:13] Maya: You know, there's some girls, not some guys. There's some girls, also.

[37:16] Ben: You're actually, you're actually right. I don't know why I said that, because two of them, yes, you were...

[37:20] Maya: I was asking if you recruited them.

[37:21] Ben: You're dead on. You're… exactly. No, we'll have you out there in no time.

[37:24] Maya: No, that sounds awesome. So, what's your favorite car?

[37:27] Ben: That's very tough. But I've fallen in love with, and this is a little more practical than the race cars, but the new Audi e-tron sleek, electric. And whenever you're on the feeder road and you tap that accelerator, you're punched into the back of your seat. I think it's got pickup, but it's also, you know, it's comfortable, right?

[37:42] Maya: Yeah. I actually test-drove that last week, so I know exactly what you're talking about.

[37:46] Ben: Right.

[37:46] Maya: That's funny that you mentioned that. We share that in common as well. So, what's next for you? What do you see yourself doing in the next 3, 5, 7, 10 years? I know it's, kind of, a big broad question, but where do you want to go?

[38:00] Ben: Yeah, I am taking it step by step. So, the first thing, now that I'm promoted to manager, is I have to choose which business practice to align to. And so, I'm revisiting a lot of what I was thinking about in the MBA. You know, where do I want to be? What industry interests me? And I have to force-rank either industries or functions, functions being things like your CFO or enterprise finance kind of stuff or enterprise strategy and pricing strategy, or M&A. And I have to pick which ones do I really want to focus on. And there's a bit of a major-minor system. If I pick, you know, M&A, then I could do something M&A in oil. Your minor would be something like in energy or in agriculture or something like that.

So, you know, where I stand right now, I love pricing and corporate strategy. And I think that's my goal, growth strategy. Secondary, tertiary, you know, energy, it makes the world go around. And Houston is such an energy-focused city. I think, between the network here and the ability to drive change here, energy would be a great place to be. And then, I'm looking at our chemicals and natural resources practice, because I love B2B work and I love the things that make the world go round. And then, that's yet another one, sort of, core engine. So, that's on the short term.

Longer term, I love where I am. I think Accenture Strategy is a great place, and I think Houston is a great place. So, going as far as I can go within the firm in Houston is the goal. And to continue to challenge myself, and to continue to look for, either, projects that are beyond anything that I've experienced or outside of the academic areas that I've, sort of, always been comfortable in. And then, also, outside the industries that I've been comfortable in, so that I can, I can continue to grow in that regard.

Other than that, you know, I have a lot of hobbies, and I just want to keep growing those, making new friends that share similar hobbies. And maybe, one of these days, I'll actually get back into piano. That's been sitting in my bedroom. I've got a piano there. I played for seven years. And I told myself over COVID I'd do it. Here we are, we're out of lockdown, and I still haven't touched it. So, maybe, that's one thing.

[40:02] Maya: Well, the Shepherd School is right there, so I bet you could get some really good teachers to, kind of, get you back into the swing of things.

[40:07] Ben: Oh, absolutely. I'd be honored.

[40:08] Maya: So, last question, if somebody is considering Rice, why Rice? Why should they choose Rice over any other school on the planet?

[40:16] Ben: Yeah. Are you seeking disruptive change? Are you seeking meaningful, disruptive change to where you are, whether that be a measurable jump in the, sort of, subject area knowledge that you've got to be better at what you're doing, or whether you're looking at recruiting into something completely new, whatever that is, you know, it is a very positive shock to whatever you've got going on. The status quo is not survive the MBA.

And I think, if that resonates with you, then you're at that spot. You're at that right moment where it's right. And I've had people come to me and ask, you know, how do you know it's the time? And that's my answer to it. So, I think that's one of the biggest ones.

And I think the other thing is, if you really look at what Rice is doing, and they… I think the school does a very good job at communicating what the school is, you know, doing, not just in Houston, but around the globe, if you’ll look at that and that message speaks to you, you're looking for a place that isn't just a place of learning, but it's a citizen and it's creating new citizens. And that's one of my favorite Rice memories, is at the end of our first week on campus, we had a bit of a champagne toast and we talked a little bit about, what is this going to enable you to do? Who are you going to be when you come out of this program? Not only are you a leader, but you're a good citizen. So, I think it's, sort of, the fusion of those things that should draw somebody to Rice.

[41:33] Maya: That's wonderful, Ben. It's been a pleasure to talk with you today. We really appreciate you taking time out of your busy schedule to be here on Owl Have You Know. And we can't wait. Maybe, we'll catch up with you in a couple of years, too.

[41:44] Ben: Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me here. I love being back on campus anytime I can.

[41:47] Maya: You're welcome anytime.

[41:50] Ben: Thank you.

[41:51] Maya: Thank you.

Thanks for listening. This has been Owl Have You Know, a production of Rice Business. You can find more information about our guests, hosts, and announcements on our website, business.rice.edu. Please subscribe and leave a rating wherever you find your favorite podcasts. We'd love to hear what you think. The hosts of Owl Have You Know are myself, Maya Pomroy, and Scott Gale.